TRAINING  &  COACHING  for  MANAGERS & LEADERS

Case Histories

Between Life and Death

David J. Marsden & Martyn Carruthers, May 2003

You're Dead Right!

You can talk to ghosts. You can ask them about how they exist, and why, and where they go next, and why not. You can enquire into their values and beliefs, into their perception of justice and love, and into their awareness of relationships. (You may ask about hidden treasure, but rich ghosts seem as rare as rich people.)

What are ghosts? ... Let's ask Encyclopedia Britannica

Relativity

You probably have about 10 - 30 living relatives that you know about. How many dead relatives do you have? Let's say 10 - 30 million, depending on how far back you consider your ancestors to be human. Your more recent ancestors - in the last half-million years - were much like you - and at least as smart. They lived, they had children and they died, and, where are they now?

As you might expect, most ghosts are - or were - ordinary people. They rarely have profound revelations. They may be peaceful and relaxed and supportive of their descendents. Or they may be depressed and obsessed, sometimes taking the concept of "tunnel vision" to an extreme.

(David) As a retired psychotherapist, I had many living clients. Many times I had clients who could not speak Canadian, and we had to work through a translator. Lately I have had dead clients, and we had to work through a trance-later.

(Martyn) Ghosts and ghost stories help explain and resolve relationship problems that transcend life and death. Whether you call them ghosts or imagination, they offer useful ways to research and increase the dynamic and systemic harmony that gives sense to our lives.

Everybody wants to go to Heaven - but nobody wants to die

In societies that are scared to death of dying, ghosts can be treated badly. In societies that accept death as an integral part of living, ghosts can be treated well. Many Catholic cultures honor the dead on special days, and light candles for them. Many Asians assume that family ghosts can be helpful and friendly, and regularly offer them prayers, incense and food. (This might be called schizophrenia in our intellectual West ...)

The Living Dead

The ghosts that we meet are often "stuck" between two time zones - between that of the living and the that of the dead. Ghosts usually have the following qualities:

1. Ghosts are dead people

(David) If this seems obvious - slow down. Some people who are still living have fully dissociated their "selves" - which may act as free agents. I remember a university professor - I knew him for years and I can't say I that ever met him. I met a very intellectual and logical "mind" - but I don't recall any sense of shared humanity. Ever. Where was his self? I thought that he haunted a classroom - while still living.

(Martyn) A human body may die unpleasantly. In my experience, pain wasn't much of an issue for ghosts - suffering was. The suffering of being abandoned or deserted by family or friends, the suffering of living life for an ideal which turned out to be hollow. The suffering of watching children and friends die. Many ghosts communicate that a painful end makes it easier to accept death; while dying in one's sleep or under the influence of psychoactive drugs might cause confusion after death.

2. Ghosts are disoriented

(David) Some of the most disoriented ghosts that I have interviewed were the ghosts of murderers and suicides. They may describe horrible fantasies - but not deathly realities. Often these ghosts communicate that murder or suicide seemed to be an "easy way out" of some problem. It's not.

(Martyn) Most ghosts seem to be confused. Many do not know that their bodies have died. They do not know what year it is, or what their body-name was. Some ghosts seem senile - they don't like where they are and they try to cling to somebody. Other ghosts are much like people with PTSD (post-traumatic stress disorder), which seems to makes sense. I'm sure that dying can be traumatic.

3. Ghosts do not know that time has passed

(David) A ghost may be unwilling to even consider that time has passed. It may cling to a fixed idea that in any moment he or she will "wake up" or "be forgiven" or that it will "complete" whatever it was doing when the body died.

(Martyn) A ghost may be frozen in time. One year or a hundred years - there may be little or no difference. A ghost may say that it is waiting for someone to return, or waiting for some specific thing to happen - so that it can move on.

4. Ghosts do not know that their bodies have died

(David) Many ghosts seem to be stuck in time warps at the time of their death, and, if time "stopped" before the moment of death, then the ghost may be convinced that it is still alive. A ghost may also believe that it was abandoned or betrayed.

(Martyn) A ghost might be shocked to find that it has no living body. A ghost may call you crazy, stupid or misinformed. "How can I be dead? Are you crazy? I am here ...!" This confusion seems more likely if a person died in their sleep or under the influence of psychotropic drugs. If a ghost has no memory of death - how can a ghost know that he or she has died?

5. Ghosts are entangled and cannot leave

(David) Ghosts are often vague as to their "next step". Some are scared of taking it, and cling to the life that they once knew. Others seem to have no idea what to do to "move on". Others are held by the living, who cling to the dead person and may provide a warm human body for the dead to call home.

(Martyn) A ghost may say that it wants to leave, but that it cannot. A ghost may communicate that it has to say something, or do something, or prevent something - before it can move on. Some ghosts communicate that they need forgiveness. Ghosts are often involved with physical and mental diseases.

6. Ghosts have little leverage

(David) Occasionally a ghost radiates energy that we call "emotions" - usually sadness, fear, guilt or anger. Some highly motivated ghosts can move physical items or manifest strange noises, fluids, items etc. They may be called poltergeists. A few are called "energy vampires" and are accused of sucking energy from the living - but in my experience, many people freely give their life-energy to the dead.

(Martyn) With enormous effort a ghost may attract the attention of the living, but most of the time they just wait. Ghosts may be bonded to a location - their places of death or their graves, or may be bonded to their genealogy - to their ancestral homes and their descendents' lives. People are more likely to be haunted than places!

Communicating with the Dead

(David) Many people communicate with ghosts. Often, these people do not recognize it. They call the communications "intuition" or "self-criticism", etc. Simply pay attention to your thoughts -  instead of responding emotionally to them. Notice if an "inner voice" is actually inside - or outside; male or female; young or old ... and then notice who or what is speaking to you!

(Martyn) A profound method of communicating with ghosts involves Dreaming Together. This requires training in lucid dreaming and interactive metaphors - and in handling whatever comes up. Dreaming Together brings unconscious "stuff" to consciousness - and there may be reasons for keeping it buried!

[ Suicide ] [ Identification ]

Exorcism - Do your Daily Exorcises!

(David) I find most exorcism to be brutal. Imagine inviting a mentally stressed relative to stay in your home - and then paying a hit-man to destroy the relative, or to force him or her leave.

(Martyn) Perhaps exorcism is better than nothing - although most ghosts have agendas, in my opinion. Sometimes the person or family being haunted is in debt to the ghost, or hurt the living person who the ghost represents. And sometimes the entanglements cross many generations.

Demon-strations

(David) I wrote about a Haunted House that had thee ghosts .. and two ... things ... from a separate reality. What we call demons are not ghosts of dead people, but entities from a normally inaccessible level of consciousness. Demons are not as easy to interview as ghosts (the trance-later may freak out).

Some entities are frightfully toxic - feeding on emotional energy that humans radiate. Psychotics and addicts may provide free "fast-food" and "all you can eat" services for demons.

Even on their best behavior, visitors from other realities can cause confusion and chaos. The entities called demons seem to follow their own paths, uncaring about whatever chaos they cause us humans.

(Martyn) A common way of inviting these problems into your life is unfinished business with dead people. This is likely if a family member dies in a way that a family feels guilty and the death is a "taboo" topic. Soulwork systemic coaching helps people end entanglements with dead people - and with the undead. See Consequences of Abortion and Suicide.

Systemic Coaching ... Systemic Coach Training

David J. Marsden is a retired psychotherapist living in Canada. David investigates stories of ghosts and demons etc. Martyn Carruthers also lives in Canada, and teaches Systemic Coaching internationally, bringing heart, science and humor into the complexities of human relationships. Email David at: and Martyn at:

[ Haunted House ] [ Curses ] [ Black Magic ] [ Dead Person Identification ] [ Demon ]